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Transmission type poll, and interest in short shifter


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Discussion Starter #1
We're taking a poll to see how much response there would be to making a new short shifter.

As those of you with manual transmissions know, the newer Kia/Hyundai cars with manual transmissions have reverse gear next to the first gear, which you have to pull up on the lever to engage, unlike the older cars which had regular reverse gears next to the 4th gear position. Because of this, our regular short shifter will not work on the Soul. The Soul needs a more complicated shifter, similar to our 6-speed short shifter which has many more parts to it and costs more than our regular 5-speed shifter.

I have no idea about the percentage of manual owners, and whether any of those owners would be interested in a short shifter.

So, here's the poll.

If we do get it made, pricing is likely to be between 120 and 150, more likely closer to the lower end, but obviously we can't set pricing yet.
 

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Just as a note from other areas in the forum, there are a LOT of manual owners. The last time I looked, well over 40% of those responding owned manual transmission Souls, though that may have changed as we've passed well over the 2000 member mark now.

That said, I've been looking for something a bit shorter with a less "spoon in a large bowl" feel when I shift. Something tight with a shorter throw would be very welcome!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
One thing that I'd like to find out is, with a short shifter and the seat in the Soul being slightly higher than a sedan, won't there be any problems with the shifter being too low?
 

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would a part like this improve feel of the shift? If the shifter addressed the issue of positive gear engagement I would be all over it. One of the things that I don't like about the soul is the rubber stick shift.
 

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One thing that I'd like to find out is, with a short shifter and the seat in the Soul being slightly higher than a sedan, won't there be any problems with the shifter being too low?
A very good question, and one I would probably answer with "Yes, there will potentially be problems." I'm very tall, so I find I have a LOT of room left, and the shifter is a bit high for me. Most people seem to find that the shifter is close to the right height.

As much as I'd like a shorter shift assembly, it's probably best you don't adjust the height too much for marketability. However, if you can come up with a variable height shift assembly (like an extra pin to add to the top to extend the height to normal), that'd be huge. Not sure I've seen many makes of these!
 

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I just installed a B & M shifter in my 91 Thunderbird SC and it's BAAAAADDDDD. The Soul's shifter feels like a wet noodle. The shifter in my SC is the same height as factory, but a lot shorter throws. It just feels precise and solid. It's awesome. If I could get something like that in the Soul, I'd be all over it. How much $$ are we potentially talking about?
 

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If I could get something like that in the Soul, I'd be all over it. How much $$ are we potentially talking about?
I'm with you, shorter throw, solid response, no "wobbly" space in gear. I'd be in for that, even if I can't shorten the actually shift assembly!

To your question, from shark's original post:
If we do get it made, pricing is likely to be between 120 and 150, more likely closer to the lower end, but obviously we can't set pricing yet.
 

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The Soul's shifter feels like a wet noodle. The shifter in my SC is the same height as factory, but a lot shorter throws. It just feels precise and solid. It's awesome. If I could get something like that in the Soul, I'd be all over it.

This is exactly what I'd be looking for! :D
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The Soul's shifter feels like a wet noodle. The shifter in my SC is the same height as factory, but a lot shorter throws. It just feels precise and solid. It's awesome. If I could get something like that in the Soul, I'd be all over it.

This is exactly what I'd be looking for! :D
Well, we have to examine the OEM shifter in detail, but from my experience, the height can be shortened, but the throw itself cannot be shortened by much. This is speaking from experience with the Tiburon 6-speed shifter, which uses the same basic principle with the shifter mechanism. If you take out the gear boot, you should be able to see the two pivot points that the shifter uses to move, the ball on the very bottom, and the ball that is about midway up the shifter. The greater the distance between these two points, the shorter the throws become, but the problem is, because of the actual gear boot and the surrounding plastic, you can only raise the second pivot point up so much, perhaps a few millimeters at most, and obviously you can't lower the first pivot point.

The theory that I listed above is valid for the Tiburon 6-speed, and as I said above, we have to check the Soul's shifter in detail to see what we can do, but I'm pretty sure that this will also apply to the Soul's shifting mechanism.

Also, about the transmission being a "wet noodle"... I'm afraid there's only so much you can do with a short shifter. Most of the issue is with the transmission itself, which obviously we can't do anything about. There are some other things you can do to tighten up the shifting, such as aluminum bushings for the shifter base, etc., and we may get to this after the shifter, depending on if there is interest in this.
 

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Shark, I'm not doubting your expertise, but if we can't shorten the throw or do anything about the sloppiness and play of the shifter, why bother? It would just be making the actual shift lever shorter? Sorry, bit I don't really have a problem with the placement of the shifter and I don't think I would pay for anything if all it did was lower it.
 

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I apparently misunderstood the original post. I thought we were talking about a short "throw" shifter and not actually shortening the shifter height as I feel that the current height is just about perfect for me personally.
 

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Shark, I'm not doubting your expertise, but if we can't shorten the throw or do anything about the sloppiness and play of the shifter, why bother? It would just be making the actual shift lever shorter? Sorry, bit I don't really have a problem with the placement of the shifter and I don't think I would pay for anything if all it did was lower it.
Same here shark. I can't see the benefit of a shorter shifter.
 

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I think there are a few things to address, some which may be looked at here and some not.

First, Shark has addressed the shorter throw issue. It may or may not be possible - I'm sure we'll find out sooner than later.

Second, there's the "this shifter feels like it's in the middle of a huge canyon" feel. If the shift assembly is reworked, I'd imagine this could be taken care of as well. It's not a transmission issue, it's a sloppy "too much space" in the assembly issue. As I mentioned before, it always feels like a spoon in a big mixing bowl, rather than something that fits properly in each shift position.

Lastly is the "looser" feel of the transmission, which there isn't much a shift assembly can do any good for. The clutch point and gears are pretty much the way they'll be without some more intricate detailing, but the shift assembly won't do anything for it.

So, what we know so far:
The shifter may or may not be shortened in height.
As a group, we seem to desire a shorter throw on the shifter if possible.
Personally, I'd like a tighter "fit" to the assembly going into gear - not sure if anyone else is also noting this as an issue to fix...

Anything else people are wondering about, just for clarity sake?
 

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"As a group, we seem to desire a shorter throw on the shifter if possible.
Personally, I'd like a tighter "fit" to the assembly going into gear - not sure if anyone else is also noting this as an issue to fix..."

The above is exactly what I'd like to see in a shifter...
It seems this might have gone dead as a topic and a possible upgrade?

any more info Shark?
 

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B&M shifter

Shark
Is there any way to modify the shifter from the Elantra touring to fit the Kia Soul? From what I understand the Elantra Touring is sold as the Hyundai i30 in Europe. I thought that the i30 and the Soul were very similar with regards to their powertrains. The i30 replaced the Kia Cee'd, which was the Euro version of the Spectra 5. The Soul replaced the Spectra 5. It would be great if we could use an existing component to help reduce the costs. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

This is from the Hyundai website:
ElantraTouring
$17,800
- 2.0L DOHC CVVT 4-cylinder engine
- 5-speed manual transmission with B&M Racing Sport Shifter
- 16” alloy wheels & P205/55R16 tires
- 4-wheel independent suspension
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I'll know more information once we begin development of the shifter. We most likely will be making a shifter regardless, because most of the newer 5-speed transmissions used by Hyundai and Kia are the same as the Soul, so the shifter should be interchangeable. AFAIK no one has made a short shifter for these transmissions so far.
 
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