[TosenR]

Michgan law really helps the employer, not so much the dead employee or the vehicle owner - at least not in this instance.

At first I thought maybe the vehicle owner had modded the car thus resulting in the accident but no.

Per an internet "news" article so don't know how completely accurate this is as I've seen different articles with differing descriptions:

A young service employee after performing an oil change went to start the manual transmission vehicle to check for leaks. He leaned into the vehicle and using his right foot (left foot is still outside the vehicle on the service bay floor) he pressed the brake and pushed the start button - nothing happened.​

​

He then moved his right foot to the clutch pedal, pressed it while also pushing the start button - vehicle starts.​

​

Without realizing the vehicle was in first gear nor that the parking brake was not set, he lifted his right foot from the clutch pedal which caused the vehicle lurch forward striking a fellow employee resulting in that persons death.​

​

The young service emplyee did not know how to drive a stick nor did he have a drivers license.​

OSHA - Accident: 124814.015 - Employee Is Killed When Struck By Vehicle

Why a Jeep owner is sued after dealership employee was killed during oil change

 

[Hammerhead]

I read about that, how in the world could the vehicle owner be responsible? Lawyer that filed that suit should be sued for filing a frivolous lawsuit and lose his license. Ambulance chasers.

 

[bwdz75]

I live in the area and actually lived near that dealership some time ago. I also know who the ambulance chaser is, the lawyer is one of those guys with billboards all over the place about all his lawsuits. The moral of this story is that Michigan is still a no fault state and car insurance is really weird and expensive. Better yet we pay a $200 premium on our insurance in MI for "uninsured drivers", if that is not messed up I don't know what is but over 50% of the city of Detroit vehicles are uninsured. I don't see why they don't make people take their driver license test on a manual trans, if you are going to be licensed to operate a vehicle you need to be able to operate it, not just some specific models as your license just says you can drive any car.

 

[jdmartin]

I read about this on another car board I'm on. What kind of dipshit dealership hires a guy as an auto tech that not only can't drive a stick but also doesn't have a driver's license?

 

[jdmartin]

I live in the area and actually lived near that dealership some time ago. I also know who the ambulance chaser is, the lawyer is one of those guys with billboards all over the place about all his lawsuits. The moral of this story is that Michigan is still a no fault state and car insurance is really weird and expensive. Better yet we pay a $200 premium on our insurance in MI for "uninsured drivers", if that is not messed up I don't know what is but over 50% of the city of Detroit vehicles are uninsured. I don't see why they don't make people take their driver license test on a manual trans, if you are going to be licensed to operate a vehicle you need to be able to operate it, not just some specific models as your license just says you can drive any car.

This guy didn't have a driver's license at all!

 

[Hammerhead]

Employers fault 100%.

 

[bwdz75]

This guy didn't have a driver's license at all!

Driver license is required to work at a dealership. So many things wrong with this and it cost someone their life.

 

[Droyed]

Michgan law really helps the employer, not so much the dead employee or the vehicle owner - at least not in this instance.

At first I thought maybe the vehicle owner had modded the car thus resulting in the accident but no.

Per an internet "news" article so don't know how completely accurate this is as I've seen different articles with differing descriptions:

A young service employee after performing an oil change went to start the manual transmission vehicle to check for leaks. He leaned into the vehicle and using his right foot (left foot is still outside the vehicle on the service bay floor) he pressed the brake and pushed the start button - nothing happened.​

​

He then moved his right foot to the clutch pedal, pressed it while also pushing the start button - vehicle starts.​

​

Without realizing the vehicle was in first gear nor that the parking brake was not set, he lifted his right foot from the clutch pedal which caused the vehicle lurch forward striking a fellow employee resulting in that persons death.​

​

The young service emplyee did not know how to drive a stick nor did he have a drivers license.​

OSHA - Accident: 124814.015 - Employee Is Killed When Struck By Vehicle

Why a Jeep owner is sued after dealership employee was killed during oil change

Wow, that seems wrong.

 

[bwdz75]

I read about this on another car board I'm on. What kind of dipshit dealership hires a guy as an auto tech that not only can't drive a stick but also doesn't have a driver's license?

This is not uncommon, plenty of places I worked at have people that can't drive a stick. I have to admit it but where I currently work at all the people in service and our porter and detailer (detailer is a woman) can drive a stick. Sadly none of our salespeople can, seriously they have to have the finance manager test drive cars that are stick shifts with customers and can't even pull them to the back to get washed or detailed. Sad, it's not rocket science, I learned in about an hour as a teenager and taught my daughters in about the same amount of time.

 

[gunrunnerjohn]

After driving for over half a century, I've observed some really poor drivers. Personally, I believe that anyone that gets a driver's license should have to take a test similar to the military driver's license test that I took when I was in the Navy. If you can hop into a strange vehicle with a stick shift and take it through a maneuvering obstacle course, you should be able to handle much of the stuff you're going to encounter in everyday driving. If you can't control the vehicle properly, you're pretty likely to run into serious difficulties driving.

I also believe that when people get past a certain age, that probably being around 70, that every few years they should have to pass a driving proficiency test. Yep, that would snag me as well, and that's OK. I'm not really worried about passing the test, and if I can't pass a basic driver's test, I probably don't belong on the roads anyway! My wife got clobbered by a guy in his 80's that simply drove into the side of her car while running a red light. Come to find out that it wasn't his first similar accident, he'd actually done it several times before. That guy does NOT belong behind the wheel!

One glaring deficiency in driving skills is driving in inclement weather. It's amazing how poorly some people handle any adverse weather conditions! Sadly, those skills are frequently learned the hard way, or people drive so slow that you have a half mile backup behind you getting madder by the minute.

 

[Hammerhead]

All states should require a driving test on a road course that includes a wet skid pad. Weave through cones etc. I bet most drivers couldn't pass it. I'm 67 years old and while I don't have the same concentration or reflexes I did 20 years ago, not bragging but I could out drive 90% of the people on the road today. And yes when I was in my 30s I drove a race car on a local track. Most drivers, in a dangerous situation freeze and lock the brakes. Proper way, modulate brakes and steer through it. And don't even get me started on women with cell phones.

 

[GeoSoul]

All states should require a driving test on a road course that includes a wet skid pad. Weave through cones etc. I bet most drivers couldn't pass it. I'm 67 years old and while I don't have the same concentration or reflexes I did 20 years ago, not bragging but I could out drive 90% of the people on the road today. And yes when I was in my 30s I drove a race car on a local track. Most drivers, in a dangerous situation freeze and lock the brakes. Proper way, modulate brakes and steer through it. And don't even get me started on women with cell phones.

When I was growing up operating a motor vehicle was called a privilege, not a right. That emphasized the responsibilities that came with driving. Man, that notion has gone out the window for a while lot of people.

 

[bwdz75]

After driving for over half a century, I've observed some really poor drivers. Personally, I believe that anyone that gets a driver's license should have to take a test similar to the military driver's license test that I took when I was in the Navy. If you can hop into a strange vehicle with a stick shift and take it through a maneuvering obstacle course, you should be able to handle much of the stuff you're going to encounter in everyday driving. If you can't control the vehicle properly, you're pretty likely to run into serious difficulties driving.

I also believe that when people get past a certain age, that probably being around 70, that every few years they should have to pass a driving proficiency test. Yep, that would snag me as well, and that's OK. I'm not really worried about passing the test, and if I can't pass a basic driver's test, I probably don't belong on the roads anyway! My wife got clobbered by a guy in his 80's that simply drove into the side of her car while running a red light. Come to find out that it wasn't his first similar accident, he'd actually done it several times before. That guy does NOT belong behind the wheel!

One glaring deficiency in driving skills is driving in inclement weather. It's amazing how poorly some people handle any adverse weather conditions! Sadly, those skills are frequently learned the hard way, or people drive so slow that you have a half mile backup behind you getting madder by the minute.

I put winter tires on my fiance's car and she still gets freaked out by the snow. The answer is she does not go out if she is not comfortable as to not be one of the idiots that blocks everyone, rather simple.

 

[Hammerhead]

Not trying to get off topic but one garage I worked in, customer dropped off a car one day. Don't remember what the repair was, but when I put it on the lift and raised it up, the car had snow tires on the rear regular all season radials on the front. Now the best part, it was front wheel drive. I never even mentioned it. If someone doesn't have any more common sense than that, why should I care?

 

[GeoSoul]

Not trying to get off topic but one garage I worked in, customer dropped off a car one day. Don't remember what the repair was, but when I put it on the lift and raised it up, the car had snow tires on the rear regular all season radials on the front. Now the best part, it was front wheel drive. I never even mentioned it. If someone doesn't have any more common sense than that, why should I care?

I totally remember that happening, but in reverse. When I bought my first Civic in the 70's (FWD was NOT common), all my dads friends would say "those snow tires are supposed to go on the back, sonny."

It blew their minds the car was front wheel drive. Back then I was lucky to afford 2 snow tires, but that little car handled the snow really well.

 

[Neanderthal]

I read about this on another car board I'm on. What kind of dipshit dealership hires a guy as an auto tech that not only can't drive a stick but also doesn't have a driver's license?

I wish I could say this is hard to believe. NO DL but he's driving? I don't know how this cannot be the dealership's fault and liability.

Employers fault 100%.

Yup 100%.

This is not uncommon, plenty of places I worked at have people that can't drive a stick. I have to admit it but where I currently work at all the people in service and our porter and detailer (detailer is a woman) can drive a stick. Sadly none of our salespeople can, seriously they have to have the finance manager test drive cars that are stick shifts with customers and can't even pull them to the back to get washed or detailed. Sad, it's not rocket science, I learned in about an hour as a teenager and taught my daughters in about the same amount of time.

Oh brother. That's a sad tale.

All states should require a driving test on a road course that includes a wet skid pad. Weave through cones etc. I bet most drivers couldn't pass it. I'm 67 years old and while I don't have the same concentration or reflexes I did 20 years ago, not bragging but I could out drive 90% of the people on the road today. And yes when I was in my 30s I drove a race car on a local track. Most drivers, in a dangerous situation freeze and lock the brakes. Proper way, modulate brakes and steer through it. And don't even get me started on women with cell phones.

Yes, that would eliminate 80-90% of the drivers on the road today.

 

[MonsterSoul]

Article I read the other day said it is state law. The car owner is responsible even if they were not driving, or even there.

That is one idiotic law.

 

[celronart]

I live in the area and actually lived near that dealership some time ago. I also know who the ambulance chaser is, the lawyer is one of those guys with billboards all over the place about all his lawsuits. The moral of this story is that Michigan is still a no fault state and car insurance is really weird and expensive. Better yet we pay a $200 premium on our insurance in MI for "uninsured drivers", if that is not messed up I don't know what is but over 50% of the city of Detroit vehicles are uninsured. I don't see why they don't make people take their driver license test on a manual trans, if you are going to be licensed to operate a vehicle you need to be able to operate it, not just some specific models as your license just says you can drive any car.

😁 Took my driver license test in my '64 Triumph TR4 (4 speed stick) ! Had my top down, due to the foggy back plastic window! The tester made me put up the top (not easy! It comes off the frame!) He was watching and waiting. Anyway, I failed that time! My parallel parking was too far from the curb!

 

[GeoSoul]

😁 Took my driver license test in my '64 Triumph TR4 (4 speed stick) ! Had my top down, due to the foggy back plastic window! The tester made me put up the top (not easy! It comes off the frame!) He was watching and waiting. Anyway, I failed that time! My parallel parking was too far from the curb!

That was gutsy celron! I chickened out & borrowed a friends automatic Rambler to take the test, even though my car was a 4 speed stick.

I wonder what makes driving a stick so hard for some people. My 2 siblings absolutely can't do it. My folks had no problem.

Seems like European drivers use them more. I'll even see emergency vehicles with sticks.

 

[MonsterSoul]

I remember Drivers Ed back in High School.
We learned the rules of the road and then went to the simulator.

Remember the Atari 2600? This was before that, or at least not in the same league.
Us kids sat in the row of cubicles (or was it a table?) equipped with steering wheel and pedals.
At the front of the room they showed a movie, on how to operate a car I guess.
It said accelerate gradually and merge into into traffic Everyone's simulator buzzed as they floored it.
The movie plodded on. Video games these days are light years removed. Holy cow.

Anyway, on the the actual car. Some large 1970's boat with power steering and brakes and automatic transmission. Pontiac? Plymouth? Buick? No idea but it was easy enough to drive. Then I got in Mom and Dads Chevy with no power steering (takes a lot of turning that wheel!), no power brakes, and 3 on the tree. That first stop sign with a slight uphill....
Think I stalled it 3 or 4 times at least. The dang car wanted to roll back when I let off the brake to use the gas.

I use a hand clutch on my bike often, but have not driven a stick shift car in a few years.