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Discussion Starter #1
The NEWS HEADLINES SAY:
CASH FOR CLUNKERS SUSPENDED!!
The so called "Cash For Clunkers" program will be suspended because the funds set aside for the effort are on the verge of running out.....


However when you read the articles - what is really happening is
- - the Dealers are having problems understanding the requirements placed on them
- - the NHTSA computers are backlogged and over loaded
- - the NHTSA can't respond quickly enough to all the Dealer questions/problems

All this should have been expected in such a complicated process and legal tangle...

The real FEAR by NHTSA is that there is already a huge backlog of deals sitting at the Dealerships... the actual / factual size of which is not known. So NHTSA has decided to pay it safe and suspend the program, until they and Dealers can catch up on the processing...

So if that is the situation - why not just call it a "Time-Out" rather than say that they are on the verge of running out of funds? It sounds to me like they simply don't know...

FWIW,
Carl B.
 

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Where are you getting this information from? I'm reading an article on cashforclunkersfacts.com, but as it's NOT the official site it's all just speculation IMO, until the cars.gov website is updated to say this.

But honestly, I'm not at all surprised. Who in Congress thought that 30 days was enough time for the NHTSA to get the system up and running, and who thought that $1 billion was going to be enough?
 

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go to cars.gov they have a "gauge" and info on there front page, its not even close to being gone, 779 million left for cars and 75 million left for class 3 trucks.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
That is because the "gauge" is based on actual funds approved for payment to the dealers. In effect the Dealers that had their act together and processed the claims correctly the first time.

The "suspension" is based on a statistical sample - that shows how many "deals" have been made by the Dealers - but that have not yet been processed though the payment system a NHTSA...
 

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The original headline is easily explained: sensationalism sells. Think of all the promos for your evening news: "The sun is vanishing beyond the local horizon!!!! Details at 11:00 on Eyewitless 76!!!!" and at 11:00 you get a weather report that says "Sunset was at 8:32 this evening."

I kind of wondered what kind of snafus would come up in this. When you consider how long it takes any government to implement a program nationwide, they really just kind of tossed this one out there almost on an impulse it seems.

On the bright side, maybe they can hire a bunch of laid-off dealership employees to help catch up on the paperwork.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Where are you getting this information from? I'm reading an article on cashforclunkersfacts.com, but as it's NOT the official site it's all just speculation IMO, until the cars.gov website is updated to say this.

But honestly, I'm not at all surprised. Who in Congress thought that 30 days was enough time for the NHTSA to get the system up and running, and who thought that $1 billion was going to be enough?
It's just my opinion - but the people in Congress really don't have a clue as to how every branch of the Federal Government actually runs. Nor do they have a clue as to the quality of the people in the various agencies.

By and large - based only on my personal experience - the people at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration are real pro's.. Very experienced in their jobs and very capable. It is the political interference at the top that simply cripples them in things like this.

Who believed that $1B would be enough? It was a compromise between the people that did not want to spend any money on this - and the people that wanted to spend $4B on the program. Reason, Logic, Research, Facts of any kind had nothing to do with it - as usual in D.C.

30 Days was plenty of time to have "the system up and running" - - it was setting all the details that implemented the law that took the time.

It's just my opinion - but if you actually read all 134 pages of the Dealer requirements - I'd say the people at NHTSA did a GREAT job - - The one thing I would have argued against, the thing that really made no sense - was the requirement for the Dealership to disable the engines in these vehicles. That requirement was basically hidden from view until the information was published - it added great expense to the Dealers or Salvage yards because it required all these clunkers to now be picked up by wreckers and take to the salvage points rather than having the driven there. Wreckers cost $75.00 to $100.00 or more today to pick up a car and deliver it within 10 miles... Where paying two minimun wage workers would cost about $20.00.. Not to mention all the additional time spent by both parties.. It was just DUMB... They should have let the salvage yards disable the engines -

If the money has been spent so quickly - It is very likely that the additional $1B or $2B will be authorized to be moved from the original $870B stimulus package.. That funding hasn't begun to be spent - and the economy is recovering quite well without it.
 

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I absolutely believe the money is already gone. If you figure $4,000 on average for each deal that is 250,000 cars. Even in this economic downturn there are still around 800,000 vehicles sold each month. And that's before CARS so to assume the money would last any time at all was just foolish. Like they say, a billion doesn't go as far as it used to!
 

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whoa am real glad i didn't wait until closer to end of year and got mine in there... unreal and so much for running until 11/1... know my dealer made some good money b/c think poisoning the engine costs about $30. and if they spent $100.to take to salvage then they made $4300+ on just me!!
 

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Just heard it now on the news.. cars.gov still says nothing.. I can imagine that there would be a back log of some sort, but wouln't they just look at the number in que and the max rebate of 4500 and know when to take the last one.. this isn't rocket science, its like managing inventory in a store.. if some arn't approved they then put that back into the available funds. so lets see there went live with this the 27th and now 4 days later they are out of money.. or think they could be .. that means the car dealers sold about 250,000 cars in 4 days.. seems like this is the only stimulus that has produced any real results.. that means in 4 days the us economy was boosted by about 3.7 to 5.8 billion on 4 days.. now thats results!

I guess if this is the case it yet again proves that the early bird does catch the worm.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Klas:
I don't think they made $4300.00 on you - -You might be forgetting that the Dealer has to pay Kia for the car. You saved the money, the Federal Government just spent the mony and the Dealers just sold a car and made a reasonable gross profit on the deal.

The unexpected costs to the Dealers, simply reduced the gross profit they thought they had..
FWIW,
Carl B.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I guess if this is the case it yet again proves that the early bird does catch the worm.
It also proves that putting money directly in hands of consumers has an immediate effect on the economy. That is why I believe that if the first Billion has been spent - Congress will authorize an additional Billion or two fairly quickly...

We'll see..

FWIW,
Carl B.
 

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sheesh - who knows what's going on??

U.S. Won't Suspend Auto "Clunkers" Program: Official
By REUTERS
Published: July 30, 2009
Filed at 11:03 p.m. ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. government will not suspend its $1 billion "cash for clunkers" auto sales incentive even though confirmed sales and pending transactions neared the limit of 250,000 vehicles much sooner than expected, an Obama administration official said on Thursday night. http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2009/07/30/business/business-us-autos-usa-clunkers-sales.html
 

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Klas:
I don't think they made $4300.00 on you - -You might be forgetting that the Dealer has to pay Kia for the car. You saved the money, the Federal Government just spent the mony and the Dealers just sold a car and made a reasonable gross profit on the deal.

The unexpected costs to the Dealers, simply reduced the gross profit they thought they had..
FWIW,
Carl B.
good point and didn't think about that but know he didn't sell me the car at the dealer's price and i have no clue what his incentives are but know he made out and even got paid to take my fred flintstone mobile away :)
 

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The problem with seeing this as a stimulus that worked in 4 days is that - so far - it's only been a 4 day stimulus. This is just a blip in sales and things will go back to where they were a week ago. Another billion bucks might get another 4 or 5 days, but this is no stimulus. The vehicles have to be destroyed, so the effect rippling through the used parts industry won't happen. The crushers/smelters will have a backlog for a week or two and then they'll be back to business as usual. We've taken a small percentage of low-efficiency vehicles out of the loop. Environmentaly this is insignificant as someone mentioned elsewhere and the carbon footprint of the new vehicle's construction and delivery will more than offset that, although it should even out over time.

The road to hell is paved with a good intention/asphalt mix.
 

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As for the environmental issues, these cars are already produced, there off the lot, there not ordered and built.. not to mention the extra efficiency and emissions on newer cars are far better than older ones of even 10 years ago.

Yeah it takes energy to make cars ecrt, but these cars are the backlog that have been sitting on the lot for a while for the most part.. sales have been slow the last few months if you have not noticed.
 

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I am curious to know just how many of us on this board have received our cars though the CARS program. We should start a poll. :D
 

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glad I got mine opening weekend. the dealer i went to was slammed on friday so I went on saturday and it was a little better. fewer selection on the cars but they still had the one I wanted to buy anyways.
 

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It's just my opinion - but the people in Congress really don't have a clue as to how every branch of the Federal Government actually runs. Nor do they have a clue as to the quality of the people in the various agencies.

By and large - based only on my personal experience - the people at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration are real pro's.. Very experienced in their jobs and very capable. It is the political interference at the top that simply cripples them in things like this.

Who believed that $1B would be enough? It was a compromise between the people that did not want to spend any money on this - and the people that wanted to spend $4B on the program. Reason, Logic, Research, Facts of any kind had nothing to do with it - as usual in D.C.

30 Days was plenty of time to have "the system up and running" - - it was setting all the details that implemented the law that took the time.

It's just my opinion - but if you actually read all 134 pages of the Dealer requirements - I'd say the people at NHTSA did a GREAT job - - The one thing I would have argued against, the thing that really made no sense - was the requirement for the Dealership to disable the engines in these vehicles. That requirement was basically hidden from view until the information was published - it added great expense to the Dealers or Salvage yards because it required all these clunkers to now be picked up by wreckers and take to the salvage points rather than having the driven there. Wreckers cost $75.00 to $100.00 or more today to pick up a car and deliver it within 10 miles... Where paying two minimun wage workers would cost about $20.00.. Not to mention all the additional time spent by both parties.. It was just DUMB... They should have let the salvage yards disable the engines -

If the money has been spent so quickly - It is very likely that the additional $1B or $2B will be authorized to be moved from the original $870B stimulus package.. That funding hasn't begun to be spent - and the economy is recovering quite well without it.
I think you misunderstood what I said. I think the NHTSA did a fantastic job getting the system up and running and writing the final rules within 30 days. However, I don't think Congress gave them enough time to properly write up and implement the system. They obviously didn't have enough time to test the servers for dealers to submit the clunkers or else they wouldn't be backlogged -- Unless they honestly didn't expect the program to be THIS popular.

But anyways, the current news is that the program MAY be suspended, but there's no official word from the government yet, just the media hype -- as usual.
 
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