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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I love my Soul but I keep driving by this Toyota Dealer in Bolton who had this little yellow mini on the lot. I went in the other day just to get a quote on a car, a quote. I didn't want to buy the vehicle.

The sales rep went over some details, passed it on to the F&I guy, who then printed up an order and asked me to sign his 'quote' Turns out that it was a sales form and I just bought a car that I didn't want. Lucky for me, the financing fell through. When I told the guy that I didn't want to buy the car and that I wanted the sales form ripped up, he snapped and started yelling at me saying that I wasted his time.
His manager came in and asked him to calm down as there were shoppers in the store..

guess I know where I won't be buying a new car... Or a used one. In his defense though, I read that the Dilawri Group is pretty hard on sales reps and pushing them to keep their numbers up.

Not worth going back in my opinion.

The math was this:

I have a 2011 KIA Soul 2U (2.0) 5-spd manual 57,000km's
Owing in total: $19350 (0% interest)
Trade in value: $9500
The Mini was $15500 (2009 automatic Cooper - not S)
Minus my Trade in of $9500
Carry over my balance owing of: $9850
Balance on Mini now is $25350 which to me was out of the ballpark already and I wasn't going to buy it at that price.
But they never show the price, just the payments... Add interest of 5.99% to that it was way too high.


The lesson learned.. 1.) Never sign anything. 2.) Don't assume that your car is worth as much as you think. 3.) Don't take your Soul for granted. I appreciate it a lot more now then I did before this karfluffle.
 

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Mini is over priced for what you get! Maintenance is expensive too. I'm glad you kept your Soul!
 

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I had a Countryman S - window sticker was $36k (though I bought it for much less cause I let the original owner take the big depreciation hit before I purchased it from him). My Soul at less than half the price is more fun to drive.

They did you a huge favor by not allowing the deal to go down.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Agreed. It also felt a bit more sluggish then my Soul. It was a 1.6, I have the 2.0.
 
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If there is financing involved in the deal you can walk away from the sale at any time no matter what you sign as long as you don't drive off in the new car. If you dont like the terms of the financing they cant hold you to the deal. The last 2 cars I bought i inked a deal with 1 dealer after making my best deal possible, I then take that little slip of paper to another dealer and tell him if he wants a sale to beat it. Then I go back to original dealer with new deal in play to get myself an even better price or added options/maintenance or whatever. Works very well!
 

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So you accidentally signed a sale contract, and when you realized it, you just decided to roll with it hoping something would come along and stop the whole process? What if financing would have went through and you actually bought the car?
Bingo! DM hit it on the head! NEVER sign for ANYTHING at a Stealer's until you are happy with the car, the deal, and the financing (if you use Stealer financing, which you can almost always beat if you use the right bank/credit union).

Your story raised a couple of red flags when I read it, the first being a signature for a QUOTE. No way, Hosea!

Before you go car shopping again (which you shouldn't have to do for a long time, since you already have your Soul!) you need to spend some quality time online where you will find TONS of info on Dealer tricks & scams. If you have a car that you are trading in, you really need to learn about the 'Four Square' which is a worksheet the dealer uses to get your hard earned cash by using a four-pronged attack - trade in, price of car & accessories, down payment, and monthly payments. They are the "Special Forces" in this battle and expect you to be a greenhorn novice in the game (which many are).They are Past Masters at wriggling the numbers around in the four squares until they have wrung your wallet out.

You can find a sample Four-Square here:The Car Dealer's Four-Square Worksheet - Edmunds Auto Finance Tips

If you HAVE to use a dealer (I almost always try to buy a 'new' car that's a year old to avoid the initial depreciation), eliminate as many of the 'squares' that you can. Get your own financing before you start shopping, sell the car you are replacing, and get some meaningful down payment money together. I KNOW that it seems so much easier to stroll in to the dealer and let them 'help' you into a new car, but they are only there to help one entity - the Dealership. I do see that you recognize that some dealerships are brutal to their sales folks, and this is quite true - but it is NOT your fault, and you have no responsibility to atone for the shortcomings of the dealer/salesman relationship.

Your best bet is to enjoy your Soul for as long as you can. Based on the informed comments from other posters, it looks like you would have 'traded down' by buying the Cooper. Use your 'Soul Time' to get an education in car buying, and you will be well served when you do have to replace your car.

Remember - in Cars & Cards, the Dealer always wins! The better you prepare yourself for the game, the better your chances will be to come out ahead.

Tom
 

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I had a Mini S, and dumped it for the Soul (although, I did become a convert to stick shifts because of it). Apart from the much higher price, there are lots of reasons to skip the Mini.

1. Maintenance and reliability on those cars is Hell. I had to pay $1,250 for a water pump install--$250 for the pump and $1,000 for the labor because it supposedly took 5 hours to replace. The first 50,000 miles were great. Afterward, I was averaging $3,000 a year, or more, in repair costs.

My maintenance and reliability experience were actually better than for some people. Go to Consumerist.org and get an eyeful.

2. The ride is harsher than the Soul. It's also tougher to get in and out. The buttons and switches on the Mini must have been designed by someone who dropped acid. After 7 years, I still could never understand how to properly search for radio stations. The newer Mini's are even worse.

3. Yes, you can feel the better made quality in the car. It also has a lot more torque and power at the high end, is stickier on the road, more maneuverable, and is definitely cooler. Nice luxuries, but not worth the aggravation.
 

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I actually think the the Soul is cooler. Really. Better lines and unique shape. Kia outmini'd the mini! If you ever have the opportunity, park your soul next to a mini and check it out. I'll take the soul!
 

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Mini is over priced for what you get! Maintenance is expensive too. I'm glad you kept your Soul!
good point, a relative on my wife's side, purchased a Mini, but said the maintenance and repairs were expensive (its a BMW after all) and he had to get the transmission repaired (out of warranty) at a cost of over $7500 :mad: - he did not keep it long after that. Enjoyed the driving but not the upkeep.
 

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BMW on numerous occasions has tried to screw owners as well. Stonewalling, pretending problems that everyone has are unique to that owner, resisting fixing things on their dime or taking back lemons unless threatened with lawsuits. I'll take the Asian's attitude and their ingrained traits of honor and taking responsibility vs. the German's it's not our problem, denial and dictator tendencies. Go to the North American Motoring forums and read the horror stories.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Lots of useful advice. I appreciate it. I'll be sticking with my current ride till it's paid for. The big issue with it is: A), I didn't tell my wife when I bought it so she refuses to drive it. B) it's a 5spd and she refuses to learn so I thought that I'd trade it in for a Auto.

so in reality, I blame my wife :)

And a big thanks to Titan Tom for that link. Thanks!
 

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You got lucky this time! The Mini has a lower than average (2 1/2 stars out of 5) certainly lower than the Soul reliability and repair record, very little rear-seat room, confusing dashboard controls, a tiny trunk and busy/bumpy ride. That's per real owner feedback and reviews in the US News and World Report. J.D. Powers and Consumer Reports confirm this as well.
I looked at many cars before I picked out my New '13 Soul Exclaim....and I'm a picky and informed buyer..as well as a real car enthusiest. And this KIA is our 3rd new KIA in the past 18 months.

I only got burned badly on one car that I bought..and I was young and foolish! It was a POS brand new FIAT right when I was in my 20's. Even tho the newest USA Market Fiats are mostly made in Mexico..it seems that so far there are few reports of issues or complaints so far from their owners yet.

Keep the Soul! :cool:
 
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